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-   -   Digital Stations Working Great But IP Phones Problems (http://support.avaya.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2034)

rogund 08-22-2012 09:36 AM

Digital Stations Working Great But IP Phones Problems
I have an IP Office 500v2 with 8 IP1608 & 1616 handsets and two digital stations which has been working fine for months. Suddenly last week, the IP phones started experiencing voice quality problems, the keypad on the handsets no longer works if you connect to an outside line to a menu system. Lines cuts out instead of dialing. Echoes when you are talking to external calls.
In the meantime, the two digital stations are working great. I think this rules out line problems.
I had version 7.x firmware. I have since upgraded to version 8.x still no luck with the IP phones
Has anyone got any idea please?

pdgavin 08-23-2012 07:32 AM

Digital Stations Working Great But IP Phones Problems
Are you using SSA to troubleshoot the issues? Do you have SSA setup to collect QoS information?


rogund 08-23-2012 11:21 PM

No, Not using SSA. I also don't think this is a QoS issues. I have eliminated the fact that it could be the PoE switch because if I powered one of the IP phones using a PoE injector and connect directly to the LAN port of the IP Office 500 box,the phone works i.e incoming and Outgoing calls are ok. However I still get the same issues where it echoes back, calls not completing sometimes, when you dial an external number requesting you to press 1 for this and 2 for that..pressing these numbers on the phone does not send the numbers to the other end...same issues whichever IP Phone I use..1608,1616 or even 9641G, Makes you think all the phones can't have corrupt firmware?

pdgavin 08-24-2012 05:49 AM

Digital Stations Working Great But IP Phones Problems
Sounds like a line issue.


rogund 08-24-2012 07:07 AM

Pete, that's was my initial suspicion. However the digital handsets are all working fine. If I call out BT to check line and can't find problem then I have to pay 180. BT already said can't find problem on the line

richa83 08-29-2012 03:20 AM

Have you tried rebooting the kit? ...this could be vcm related , also run monitor take some traces, if you have development tracing ticked on the system tab , you can look at RTP traffic, packet loss(true packet loss not like ssa) and obviously look at the traces to define what is potentially causing the issue.

If you have a power block try rebooting the switch first first and if no fix, a different switch as even if the phones are not powered by the poe they are still routing all the packets over it.

pdgavin 09-02-2012 05:03 PM

Digital Stations Working Great But IP Phones Problems
Rather than dismiss the idea that it may be QoS issues why not use the free and very easy to use tools that are built into the phones and the IP Office. It is very easy to setup and if you set it up in the System/Events tab to email you, you don't even have to do anything except sit back and wait for an email. If you can run it for a week and you are not notified that there was a problem then you can safely eliminate it as a possible cause.

"When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth". Sherlock Holmes.


QoS Parameters: Release 5.0+.
These parameters are used if Enable RTCP Monitor on Port 5005 is selected (Systems | LAN1 | VoIP). They are used as alarm thresholds for the QoS data collected by the system for calls made by Avaya H.323 phones and for phones using VCM channels. If a monitored call exceeds any of the threshold an alarm is sent to the System Status application. Quality of Service alarms can also be sent from the system using Alarms.
The alarm occurs at the end of a call. If a call is held or parked and then retrieved, an alarm can occur for each segment of the call that exceeded a threshold.
Where a call is between two extensions on the system, it is possible that both extensions will generate an alarm for the call.
An alarm will not be triggered for the QoS parameters recorded during the first 5 seconds of a call.
Round Trip Delay (msec): Default = 350.
Less than 160ms is high quality. Less than 350ms is good quality. Any higher delay will be noticeable by those involved in the call. Note that, depending on the compression codec being used, some delay stems from the signal processing and cannot be removed: G.711 = 40ms, G.723a = 160ms, G.729 = 80ms.
Jitter (msec): Default =20.
Jitter is a measure of the variance in the time for different voice packets in the same call to reach the destination. Excessive jitter will become audible as echo.
Packet Loss (%): Default = 3.0.
Excessive packet loss will be audible as clipped words and may also cause call setup delays.
Round Trip Delay

Good Quality

High Quality

Round Trip Delay

< 350ms

< 160ms


< 20ms

< 20ms

Packet Loss

< 3%

< 1%



Quality of Service Alarms

IP Office 5.0+ supports Quality of Service (QoS) monitoring for IP Office extensions. This is enabled through the Enable RTCP Monitoring on Port 5005 (System | LAN1 | VoIP) setting within the IP Office configuration.
The current quality of service information for a call is displayed within SSA on the extension's Extension Status form. That information is displayed for Avaya H323 IP phones registered with the IP Office. It is also displayed for other extension when they are on a call involving an IP Office VCM channel.
The thresholds for quality of service alarms are set within the IP Office configuration (System | System Events | QoS Parameters). Separate thresholds are set for Round Trip Delay (default 350ms), Jitter (default 20ms) and Packet Loss (0.5%). At the end of a call where any one of the thresholds has been exceeded, the IP Office will output an QoS alarm containing details of the call and the maximum value of each of the QoS measures during the call.

For calls that are held or parked and then resumed, separate QoS alarms may be output for each segment of the call. If the call involves several extension, separate alarms may also be output for each extension.


Is it only a single phone or is it all IP Phones. If it is all IP phones what is the likelyhood that they all went bad at the exact same moment? If they were working fine and all of a sudden they started having problems it is unlikely to be software releated. I suppose it could be the IP Office but then why are the digital phones working okay? It may be the VCM or it may be the lan1 but I haven't heard of those going bad although I suppose it is possible. It is more likely that something changed on the network, like a duplicate IP address or a broadcast storm or a bad nic card causing chatter on the network. If you were going to escalate the case to Avaya Support they would want to have a network diagram and network assement and system monitor traces along with sniffer traces. SSA and IP Office system Event monitoring should be your first step. It is extreemly easy to setup and if it passes at least you can move on to other possible causes before you escalate.

Peter Gavin| Technical Support Engineer|ATAC - IOC|8744 Lucent Blvd. |Rm 446E276 |Avaya - ACA, ACS-M, ACS-I, ACE, ACSS – SME Communications

reid12 05-31-2013 10:19 PM

We have similar problems with "all" our IP Office deployments with IP Phones. We have run QOS tests with testing gear, and have found no issues with the network. Keep in mind with all our IP Office deployments they are local LAN networks, with 1 or 2 network switches at most.

As well, digitized voice and one way talk path issues, typically can be controlled by the network. But echo and volume issues, are typically a sign of issues with digital to analog conversions. When using digital stations, there is no conversion since going from analog (phone set) to analog (carrier signal). When going from an IP Phone to a carrier signal that is analog, then you will have a conversion, and hence a potential for echo or volume issues. Would seem logical then if using an IP Phone, may be better to use SIP trunking to the carrier since it will stay digital to digital.

Thus, with the current scenario where we have IP Phones and a carrier signal that is an analog circuit, we have still not found a resolution. Customers have all been complaining about echo problems. We have changed out analog cards within the IP Office and still no resolve.

Is anyone else having these issues? Has anyone else found a fix for this problem?

We tried adjusting the echo gain parameters, but has minimal impact.

I have heard that if using AT&T as the carrier, may have better results if having to keep with analog circuits. Anyone using AT&T for their PSTN circuits?

asimbu 06-27-2013 01:12 AM

Issue with echo when making to external call
I have similar issue. Call between IP phones are excellent but when making external call to mobile and landline over PSTN; echo can be heard during 2 - 3 second of call then disappeared. How do I check on this issue? :(

furrerm 06-28-2013 07:56 AM

You have not indicated what type of trunks you have.

And, as Pete has mentioned, do not dismiss QoS.

Are you using CCR? If so, Are the CCR agents using IP sets? Are those agents in alot of hunt groups?

Are Vlans set up for voice? Who set them up?

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